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As I did in my spoken intro to this episode, I want to begin this blogspot with a clarification. The interviews that have made the two parts and episodes with Dr. Lengnick were done in early June. You may know that beginning September 24 the rain from Hurricane Helene began to come through the area where I live, which is in Black Mountain, North Carolina, just east of Asheville, North Carolina. The primary impact of that event occurred on the night of September 26-27. It was devastating and in many places it was catastrophic. I posted Part 1 on September 24, the day the rain began. It is just now that I am able to post Part 2. My original intention was to post this episode a week after posting Part 1.

Because both of these interviews on Resilient Agriculture directly speak to the issues that bear on the impact of Hurricane Helene, Dr. Lengnick wanted to make sure that you, my listeners, understood that these interview were made 3 months prior to the impact of the hurricane and not as a response to it.

However, some reflection in light of the ideas and principles of Resilient Agriculture upon the event of Hurricane Helene needs be provided. Dr. Lengnick has graciously agreed, when the time is more appropriate, to return for a third interview, especially to speak about her understanding of the idea of bouncing forward rather than bouncing back. We will look forward to that interview.

In this episode, Laura talks about her experiences in having been active in promoting Resilient Agriculture for a while now, she speaks about the importance of stories to the promotion of Resilient Agriculture and tells us some stories, and she provides a very helpful list of things we non-agricultural folks can do to participate with and in Resilient Agriculture.

Dr. Lengnick is the author of Resilient Agriculture: Cultivating Foods Systems for a Changing Climate. This book will be the basis for these interviews.

Laura is the founder and principal of Cultivating Resilience which works with organizations of all kinds to integrate resilience thinking into assessment, operations and strategic planning. Trained as a soil scientist, Laura has 30 years of experience as a researcher, policymaker, educator, activist, and farmer. She has broad federal policy expertise gained through work as a U.S. Senate staffer, a USDA-ARS researcher, and a lobbyist advocating for sustainable agriculture in the U.S. Congress and was a lead author of the 2013 United States Department of Agriculture’s report, Climate Change and Agriculture in the United States: Effects and Adaptation.

You can learn more about Cultivating Resilience and Laura here:

cultivatingresilience.com

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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In this episode and the next I interview Dr. Laura Lengnick about resilient agriculture. Resilient agriculture is a step beyond sustainable agriculture and is being developed as a correction to industrial agriculture and in response to climate change.

Dr. Lengnick is the author of Resilient Agriculture: Expanded and Updated Second Edition: Cultivating Foods Systems for a Changing Climate. This book will be the basis for these interviews.

Laura is the founder and principal of Cultivating Resilience which works with organizations of all kinds to integrate resilience thinking into assessment, operations and strategic planning. Trained as a soil scientist, Laura has 30 years of experience as a researcher, policymaker, educator, activist, and farmer. She has broad federal policy expertise gained through work as a U.S. Senate staffer, a USDA-ARS researcher, and a lobbyist advocating for sustainable agriculture in the U.S. Congress and was a lead author of the 2013 United States Department of Agriculture’s report, Climate Change and Agriculture in the United States: Effects and Adaptation.

You can learn more about Cultivating Resilience and Laura here:

cultivatingresilience.com

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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This episode checks in with Choristers Guild. I began my ministry in church music in the late-1970s and early 1980s, and Choristers Guild was a primary source I turned to for wonderful and high-quality children’s Christian music. Back then, church music was organized around graded choirs and music ensembles. But during the mid-1970s and early 1980s, the “seeker” churches grew rapidly and with them the use of “contemporary” Christian music. During the 1990s “contemporary” Christian music became dominant. The result, often, was the loss of graded choir programs.

In its origins, Choristers Guild had a strong focus on children’s music. This episode seeks to learn of the state of things in church music and how Choristers Guild is navigating the challenges of the current situation with Christianity in the United States and music ministry.

My guests are Katie Houts and Mark Burrows. Katie has worked with Mark in editing some of his music pieces.

Katie Houts is the Sacred Choral and Curriculum Editor for Choristers Guild. Serving CG since 2013, Katie curates and edits sacred choral anthems, collections, musicals, curriculum, and teaching resources; she also serves on the faculty of the Choristers Guild Institute. She studied music at Wartburg College (Waverly, IA), where she majored in Church Music (Organ) and Religion. She has served in ELCA, UCC, and UMC congregations as Director of Music, Worship Curator, Organist, and Children’s Choir Director.

Katie is a published composer, professional accompanist, and a frequent clinician at sacred conferences throughout the country. She currently serves on ACDA’s National Committee for Composition Initiatives, working to support and champion the work of living choral composers.

Katie is based in Salt Lake City, where she leads choral ensembles throughout the community, including Rise Up Children’s Choir – Utah’s premiere contemporary vocal performance group for ages 6-18. She conducts RUCC’s intermediate ensemble, Rise Up Ignite, and is the assistant director and accompanist for the advanced mixed children’s choir. She also teaches second grade music and directs the 5th and 6th grade choirs at Wasatch Charter School (Holladay, UT).

What Choristers Guild and other publishers say about Mark Burrows is this:

Mark Burrows (b. 1971) is a composer and clinician whose works are published by many major houses, including The Lorenz Corporation, Shawnee Press, Abingdon Press, Choristers Guild and Warner Brothers. Several works, such as the Gettin’ Down with Mama Goose Series, The Body Electric, and Outside the Lines top many best-seller lists.

Known to little listeners as “Mister Mark” he tours the country performing concerts for children and families. His three children’s albums – You’ve got a Song, Go Ape!, and Go, Galileo! – have won a total of nine national awards. His songs can be heard on XM Radio, and one song, Amazon Rock, was recently recorded by Nick Records for a Dora the Explorer album.

Mark is currently the Director of Children’s Ministries at First United Methodist Church – Fort Worth, Texas, where he leads the weekly Children’s Message, a monthly worship service for families called Children First, and directs the 65-voice Youth Choir.

Mark received his undergraduate degree in music education from Southern Methodist University, and his graduate degree in conducting from Texas Christian University. He lives in Fort Worth with his wife, Nina, and their two daughters, Emma and Grace.

What Mark prefers to say about himself is this:

Mark loves traveling the country reminding people how amazing they are and how, together, they can do amazing things! While Mark does not have perfect pitch, he does have “perfect dynamics.” He can tell, just by listening, if a piece of music is loud or soft. Mark loves cinnamon rolls and tacos but can’t stand peas. He’s a Ravenclaw, and he adores classical music (especially Haydn for his sense of humor). Current musical acts he’s into right now are Lake Street Dive, Jon Batiste, and Cosmo Sheldrake. He owns 10 pairs of Converse high-tops, but sometimes he mix-matches to make even more pairs! Mark lives in Fort Worth, Texas with his wife Nina. And he occasionally feels sorry for himself that their daughters, Emma and Grace, have moved away to college so they can become a nurse and music therapist respectively, and save the world.

The use of Mark’s anthems, Seeds, and I Am Home, is with permission from Choristers Guild.

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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This episode is Part 2 of my interview with Jeffrey Stout on democracy.

In Part 1 Dr. Stout explained the different ways democracy has been understood throughout history, he gave us two definitions of liberty and freedom, and he spoke of the seven virtues he believes are essential for citizens to develop in order to participate in maintaining a healthy democracy.

In this episode, Dr. Stout discusses the threats that presently exist to our democracy here in the United States and then develops the roll we have as citizens to respond to these threats and to insuring that our democracy thrives.

Dr. Stout is Professor of Religion, Emeritus at Princeton University. He is a theorist and historian of democratic culture. His work is concerned with ethics, religious thought, political theory, law, and film. The two of his books that I draw upon for these two episodes are Democracy and Tradition, and Blessed Are the Organized: Grassroots Democracy in America. His two lectures which I draw from for these interviews are his 2017 Gifford Lectures titled ‘Religion Unbound: Ideals and Powers from Cicero to King’ and his 2022 Frederic R. and Molly S. Kellogg Biennial Lecture on Jurisprudence titled ‘The Tree of Democratic Liberty.’ Both of these lectures can be found on Youtube.

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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This episode is Part 1 of my conversation with Professor Jeffrey Stout about our democracy.

There is a broad conviction that our democracy here in the United States is in crisis. In my mind, Dr. Stout is one of the most important scholars of democracy and also one of the best guides for us learning what we, as citizens, need to understand and do to improve our democracy and maintain its thriving.

Dr. Stout is Professor of Religion, Emeritus at Princeton University. He is a theorist and historian of democratic culture. His work is concerned with ethics, religious thought, political theory, law, and film. The two of his books that I draw upon for these two episodes are Democracy and Tradition, and Blessed Are the Organized: Grassroots Democracy in America. His two lectures which I draw from for these interviews are his 2017 Gifford Lectures titled ‘Religion Unbound: Ideals and Powers from Cicero to King’ and his 2022 Frederic R. and Molly S. Kellogg Biennial Lecture on Jurisprudence titled ‘The Tree of Democratic Liberty.’ Both of these lectures can be found on Youtube.

My own commitment to democracy and religious liberty is rooted in my Baptist heritage.

The kind of Baptist community into which I was born and to which I grew up to embrace, articulated its beliefs in a document called The Baptist Faith and Message (TBFaM. The edition I am using is 1971). Principal among those beliefs is ‘soul freedom’ as Baptist historian, Walter Shurden, calls it in his book, The Baptist Identity: Four Fragile Freedoms (TBI), or as Baptist theologian, E. Y. Mullins, calls it in his book, The Axioms of Religion, ‘the competency of the soul in religion (TBFaM p.8).’

For Baptists of my ilk, this soul freedom is rooted in the nature of God and subsequently in the nature of who we are as individuals. God is free and in creating us as individuals, God created us in God’s image. This image in which each of us is created gives to each of us freedom, equality, dignity, and worth. Freedom of thought and choice are essential for true relationships, fellowship, and communion. These freedoms are the basis by which we are able to love. Thus, soul freedom is what empowers us to be able to respond to God, to enter into true relationship with God and to love God. It is also the means by which we can relate to and love one another.

As free and equal individuals before God, we each are thus free and equal before one another–any and all others—before any and all people and any and all organizations. But having this freedom also includes responsibility and accountability. We become responsible and accountable for our thoughts and choices.

Soul freedom is both exclusive and inclusive (TBFaM p.8). As Shurden defines it, Soul Freedom is the affirmation of the inalienable right and responsibility of every person to deal with God without or to the exclusion of the imposition of creed, the interference of clergy, or the intervention of civil government (TBI p.23). But, as The Baptist Faith and Message says, it includes all elements of true faith (TBFaM p.9).

Thus Mullins lists six axioms:

The theological axiom: The holy and loving God has the right to be sovereign (and is thus free).

The religious axiom: All souls have an equal right to direct access to God.

The ecclesiastical axiom: All believers have a right to equal privileges in the church.

The moral axiom: To be responsible a person must be free.

The religio-civic axiom: A free Church in a free State.

The social axiom: Love your neighbor as yourself.

As The Baptist Faith and Message says, religious liberty does not rest upon a legal document of a political state…A free state does not create religious liberty. It only recognizes and respects it. But religious freedom is essential in the making of a free state (TBFaM pp 141-142).

It continues to assert that in a free state, religious liberty means the right of every person to worship or not worship as that person’s conscience dictates. It means equality before the law in all matters relating to faith or unbelief (my paraphrase) (p.141). My Baptist ancestors were always equally passionate about defending the freedom of unbelievers as much as believers.

As I and Baptists like me understand it, in a community of equals—any community of equals including any faith organization and any form of civic government, democracy is the rightful and essential means of decision making.

The Baptist Faith and Message states, ‘Religious liberty is not religious toleration. Religious toleration is a privilege granted by people (and I will add, by power). Religious liberty is a right bestowed by God. For liberty involves responsibility and demands inner and personal controls (TBFaM p.141)’. Although others throughout our nations history have not grounded this definition of liberty in the theology I have just outlined, they nevertheless share this definition. This definition becomes important to a better understanding of democracy.

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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This episode is my second interview with John Mabry. In this episode we focus specifically on his music and his newest album, No Stranger. As you will hear in the episode, John has a brain tumor that can be removed, but the result will be that it will make him deaf. So, the airing of this episode of John’s music is especially pertinent and poignant. I am deeply honored and blessed that John reached out to me as one of his last interviews before his surgery. This new album is powerful and has much to teach us about God and our faith in Jesus Christ.

The Reverend Dr. John R. Mabry is a United Church of Christ pastor specializing in interim ministry. But he is also an author, songwriter, spiritual director, and seminary professor. He is the author of more than 40 books, writing on spirituality, spiritual direction, and theology, but he also writes science fiction and fantasy. John is a veteran of two progressive rock bands—Mind Future and Metaphor—but in the last few years has released a string of solo albums. His latest is called “No Stranger,” and it is available on BandCamp and all major streaming services. He lives with his wife and three Boxers in the foothills of the Catskill mountains in New York.

You can learn more about John and his recent creative activities from his website, johnrmabry.com

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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This episode is the first of what I hope will be a series of conversations with pastors about how they are leading, guiding, and navigating their churches through current times.

As the Pew Research Center has documented, Christianity in the United States is in decline. Thousands of churches each year are closing. In churches across the nation across the theological and political spectrum, congregations consist of aging members and declining numbers. Sanctuaries are filled to only one fourth to one third of the seating capacity, and much of the entire building space goes unused. The reasons for this decline are complex and comprised of numerous components. We are still in the midst of gaining some understanding and what understanding we have is evolving. Decline is not the only issues churches are facing and some of the other issues are contributors to the decline.

What this series seeks to explore is how churches are navigating these times by listening to the thoughts of pastors as they describe their situations and contexts and what they and their churches are doing. The pastors I am choosing to interview serve historic mainline congregations that have been a part of their communities for over 100 year and the facilities of which are often listed in the National Register of Historic Places. The pastors also began serving their churches prior to, served in the midst of, and are continuing to serve following the Covid Pandemic.

My first guest in this series in my own pastor, The Reverend Dr. Austin McIver Dennis, who is Senior Pastor of First Baptist Church of Asheville, North Carolina. ‘Mack,’ as he prefers to be called, is a native of Henderson, North Carolina. He came to First Baptist, Asheville in 2016. Prior to that, for five years he was pastor of First Baptist Church, Mt. Gilead, North Carolina, then received his Th.D. from Duke Divinity School with a focus on homiletics and reconciliation. He is the editor of The Luminous Word: Biblical Sermons and Homiletical Essays, which is an anthology of sermons and essays by Old Testament scholar, Ellen F. Davis.

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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My guest for this episode is Liz Cooledge Jenkins. In this episode we discuss her book Nice Churchy Patriarchy: Reclaiming Women’s Humanity from Evangelicalism.

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In this episode I welcome back Dr. Jonathan “Jay” Augustine to discuss the sequel to his book Called to Reconciliation: How the Church Can Model Justice, Diversity, and Inclusion. You can listen to my interview with Dr. Augustine on that book in episode 89. The sequel is When Prophets Preach: Leadership and the Politics of the Pulpit.

If Called to Reconciliation is about the Church’s responsibility to fulfill its ministry of reconciliation given to it by our God, When Prophets Preach is about the leadership necessary to enable the Church to engage in and seek to achieve its ministry.

Dr. Augustine serves as senior pastor of St. Joseph AME Church in Durham, NC. You can learn more about Dr. Augustine on his website:

https://www.jayaugustine.com/

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.

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My guest for this episode is Dr. David Bjorlin. Dr. Bjorlin is a hymn text writer. As an Assistant Professor of Worship at North Park University, David prepares his students for lives of significance and service by guiding and equipping them with practical skills centered around worship. “I believe what and how we worship forms the people we are and the way we interact with the world,” he says. As the assistant chapel coordinator at North Park and the pastor of worship and creative arts at the Resurrection Covenant Church, Bjorlin incorporates his experiences into the classroom by combining theory, practice, and reflection. Framing his classes through a city-centered lens, Bjorlin emphasizes that to understand worship, one must first understand location. He aims to teach students the importance of learning what it means to be a Christian living in a particular city surrounded by different cultures.

David’s YouTube channel can be found here:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUXJEzza9ABOLCPKfdXHl_w

The intro and outro music for this episode is from a clip of a song called ‘Father Let Your Kingdom Come’ which is found on The Porter’s Gate Worship Project Work Songs album and is used by permission by The Porter’s Gate Worship Project.